I could also surmise that in a knowledge economy, high bandwith and low latency connections are very importance, and that in-person communication are much higher bandwith and lower latency than remote.

You should consider that among the things less conducive to team productivity and mental health are "the guy in the room" types who exhibit the same lack of interest in normal social interaction with their colleagues you are claiming here under the incorrect label "professionalism".

Both of these are common scenarios at Google, though.

If any serious work is being done in a company, it does not look like that. Why do people keep pedalling this lie? A big problem in engineering is a lot of the work is done by engineers in private and the supervisors don't get to see it or experience it. So they think it happens by magic and that maybe the laughing execs actually contributed to it.

Unfortunately there's a huge amount of people employed in offices who literally do come in all day and don't do any work. Working from home means you actually have to have some work to do. What we're seeing is a load of people realising they have no work to do.

Insisting on presence is the only reason knowledge workers in western countries can claim income they have right now. Because in knowledge economy without insisting on presence, there is absolutely no reason to pay a westerner more for the same job that can be done by someone in India, China, East Europe or Africa.

Unless you can claim with a straight face that westerners are more knowledgable.

Also keep in mind that it may be slower than with direct in person mentoring but there can also be the opposite of in person mentoring and then being locked in the same office can become extremely stressful.

I also run a small team with new hires on one day and I'm seeing great productivity and teamwork.

We are going back to the office eventually but I don't think the on-site requirements will be as strict as in the past. In the medium term I see us moving towards a more flexible model beyond just the flexible allocation of desks (which imho. is a horrible thing, pretending to be office workspace and serving neither then needs of people there nor the companies output).

My employer has always (started in 2007) been fully remote; we've never had office space ANYWHERE. It's a small team building a relatively niche product, and we're pretty successful, but what you say is true:

Getting new people up to speed is hard. And hiring "baby developers" is just not something we've done. All our hires are midcareer or later. I feel like a fresh dev needs the office environment to get traction early in their career, and we just can't provide that.

In my experience part remote works much better, if not better than fully remote / fully office based. It's nice have a few days a week for in person meetings then some quiet time to get stuck into work at home.

I mean they must realise this is a pretty unpopular decision so why not share their justification.

Otherwise it's just an appeal to authority - "Ours not to reason why.."

But that still assumes the executives making these decisions prioritize employee well-being and work productivity. No amount of correctly collected, analyzed and understood data on WFH productivity will help if the change isn't driven by concerns about productivity. In that case, this data is just irrelevant. I believe this is the concern GP is expressing - that the goals of the management are not well aligned with the goals of the employee (which is obvious), and the well-being of the company (which is plausible).

--

[0] - I'm willing to give the benefit of the doubt here to Google, at least in areas where it matters. I'm not usually giving it to a typical company, Internet or otherwise: just because you have data, doesn't mean you have the right data, have analyzed it correctly, or even employ anyone who could analyze it correctly (or employ decision makers who could understand and vet the conclusion of the people doing the analysis). In my experience, these failures are very common.

[1] - I have my doubts where it comes to their product decisions.

The vast majority prefer not to come to the office everyday. Google says you can only work from home slightly more than 1 day per month.

If they took the survey into account, it would have been the opposite - you're only required to come into the office 14 days per year.

And is it the same for everyone? Like for HR, sales, marketing?

and all of these companies are now asking their employees back to the office full time in a week or so.

i am sure that if productivity hadn't dropped during WFH then there wouldn't be such a big issue. but when the whole company stops producing, then it's pretty clear what needs to be done...

It is also likely that we are talking about a young demographics which lacks the maturity needed to work remotely efficiently through self-control (I've been that kind 15 years ago for my first remote experience which was a disaster, but my second remote experience was opposite, extremely positive for myself and my output). I didn't pay attention to it when I started writing, but the fact that you mention "gamedev" is a good hint at this.

Sales and marketing seem to work as usual though, just from homes. Obviously game sales skyrocketed over past year, so it is hard to reliably grade their performance.

One production team that started transition to remote work before pandemic reported no significant slowdown. They hired bunch of highly skilled multi-disciplinary contractors all over the world and let go most of their regular staff, but it is fairly small team so I don't think this approach can scale.

When I see the OP comment which claims WFH is the only way and any other way to is just "backward thinking" in a very self-aggrandizing manner, I just remind myself that internet is safe haven for the type of people, whom I will rarely meet in real life.

depends on how replacible you really are.

if productivity stayed the same, no-one would have said anything.

For the latter, there are times when you need to think about working, and when you're doing that, being in the office with a group of people and a whiteboard is invaluable. But at some point, you know what you need to do, you just need to get into a flow and do it. And that is near impossible in modern offices. That is especially important for engineers, but it also applies to accountants and designers and carpenters and any productive labor that isn't management.

Introvert/extrovert doesn't come into play, all productive labor needs to get into states of deep focus.

Maybe if engineers all had doors that closed, but for some damn reason we haven't had those since the 1960s.

I'm certain that there will be an outpouring of hundreds of reasons why people cannot move, and I'm sure all of those reasons have merit. But it doesn't change the fact that long commutes are a huge detriment to work/life balance.

I commute 2x 40-50 minutes plus if I work at the office I have a forced 1h break, so around a little bit less than three hours of life have been given back to me during remote work. I understand your sentiment and I share it completely. I am now able to run errands, exercise, nap, clean the house, play video games, or work in my garage during this found again time. I often feel shy to admit that the pandemic-induced shift to remote work has given me back a lot. My boss lives a 5 minutes walk away and will never ever understand what it means to have to commute every day.

I don't know how others feel, but I am not outgoing enough to use the foosball and pingpong tables that are common in development studios, I feel so judged; so those are (for me) not perks at all.

I try not to build too much of an us-vs-them philosophy into either the site design or the marketing message, but I hope to soon have an XHR-type feature where the hiring manager instantly sees the effect that each piece of job metadata (remote work-ability, interview format, etc.) has on their prospective candidate pool as they enter the job info.

I think this could send a useful signal upstream to the industry at large.

You can see all of the filterable attributes by directly visiting https://sievejobs.com/job-seeker

And I'd love to hear any feedback that anyone might have.

I've started going back into the office now for brainstorming because just being able to talk without latency and without only one person being able to talk at once the difference is just night and day, not to mention the casual non-meeting non-slack chats where ideas are born.

I think remote work is now something people will demand but I can't be the only person who's noticed the difference especially in creativity focused work and believe the end game within 2 years will be the people in the office will work on the interesting stuff and remote will work on fixing bugs. Which of course will trickle on to impact salary unfortunately.

Please don't talk for all of us. If you're miserable in the office that's fine, but it's noones duty to support your preferences. This is why we have this amazing free market - everyone can work at a company that respects their preferences.

Also I feel for the people who's work was supporting workers in, y'know, work. I no longer live there, but even a crappy day in London for me was brightened by the countless interactions with people, the guy in the magazine shop, a new hipster pop up cafe, the street vendors selling exciting new food. Will they work from home?

I think one of the major challenges for an organisation is how to get peak performance from a diverse team (in terms of life circumstances and personality) and still maintain one culture and a ‘team mind’ where everyone is safe and content with their work.

I’m not a WFH evangelist really: remote is just another modality, with its own costs and benefits. It just doesn’t seem to get a fair hearing in a lot of places.

"spending time with family" - no, I'm single and alone and so are most of my co-workers

"living in a nicer / cheaper location" - no, my office is nicer than my home and same for most of my co-workers.

Your situation and needs are different than mine apparently.

"A couple" can mean anything from two to full week. I can assure you that at least for some people one day is enough.

For you maybe. For some of us, the office is like a monastery compared to home and is the only place where deep work is even close to possible. As we return to normal, I hope more employers embrace a hybrid approach that allows everyone to thrive.

And yet in my home it's accurate. Of course, your mileage may vary.

Where I work, it's like a library. Quiet, serene, productive, but tense.

At home it's noisy, disjointed, non-productive [hey look, I'm on HN!], and full of disruptions [slack, 5+ zoom meetings per day, kids screaming [Brother keeps hitting me!!!], and wife trying to live her life [TV, music, etc...]. But it's relaxed.

I prefer working from home, I feel like it's better, but there is a lot that can be improved.

And thus a veneer of legitimacy curtails the otherwise dragging distraction of guilt.

Most of the world is not like that. For example[1], avg apartment size in Bangalore 1260 sqft and in Mumbai is 700 sqft. Most of the knowledge workers live in dense cities around the world and it is not feasible for them to move to the US suburbia.

[1] https://realty.economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/residential...

And it looks exactly like other non-productive things at work: in my morning standup i can say: " i got pulled into a meeting about 'random irrelevant issue' so thats my day"

'Home distraction' are considered slacking

My life improved so much since working from a co-working. I looked for a place that shared my work/life style and I've made friends, we share lunch, we've gone on trips, we usually share a friday drink, etc. And since everyone works on different things and/or companies it's quite interesting as well to get some other input that's not just work colleagues.

I also looked for a place 2min from my house so I still have most of the benefits of WFH

That said, self motivation and lack of external pressure can be a problem. When I feel I have a hard time to focus on something my last resort is the pomodoro timer. I sit down, set a timer at 25 minutes and force myself to no break focus during that time. Once the first period is over it's usually no problem to keep going since I've gotten into something by then.

Aside from the obvious (wear headphones, keep work area away from common areas) something else we did was set a boundary limit. If I was in the bedroom, that was now the “office” and was to be treated as such. This one is more personal but I tended to get too annoyed at the interruptions at first without realizing that I needed to make more effort to help and not be (to put it bluntly) a dick about it. My girlfriend started getting in the habit of tidying up or doing crafts during her downtime instead of coming to me after we discussed the huge amount of distraction it caused.

Ultimately though the living situation is what made it hard. We were in San Diego, in a cramped two bedroom apartment that had no privacy. We moved and bought a house where I now have a large upstairs loft area as my office. That is absolutely not the answer to everything but I think some of the issue is just most people not being prepared or having the right accommodations.

My advice sucks but if you have any specifics I can try to help out and answer more. It’s hard but hang in there if you feel it’s just a rough spot.

It's "our time starts at 5pm, dinner, and the rest of the evening".

Lunchtime walks together works for me too.

2 a light outside the door or a sock on the door let’s people know you cannot be disturbed

3 don’t forget to open the door when you can legitimately be disturbed

4 calmly and clearly state that you are at work while door is locked/light is on/sock is on the door. Compare to partner being at work/school and you being unable to barge in

5 meditate because this won’t be resolved over night

Like you it took threatening to leave (renting an office space and working from there. She was not fond of throwing out $1200/mo) for my wife to take it seriously. I have been working remotely for almost a decade now but over the last 3 years my wife stopped taking it seriously. The pandemic seems to have driven the fact home (esp when our little one would disturb her while she was working)

You must realize working remotely is not common and with any new lifestyle change there will be adaption periods. Some people longer than others. The ultimatum usually gets their attention but not always the way you would like (my wife refuses to enter the office now, which is also not what I want but baby steps)

In other words, respect your own boundaries first. That goes a long way towards helping other people recognize the same boundaries.

You may want to come to an agreement on questions like:

- What is work time? How will my partner know?

- Are there any scheduled breaks?

- Are there any moments during work time when it is ok to come disturb?

- What is an acceptable urgent reason to disturb work time?

- ...

... says the person who is still disorganised about this after an entire year of covid-19.

I’ve been putting real effort into this: I dumped social media years ago, so now I just message someone individually if I want to talk to them. I’ve really focused on 1-on-1 friendships versus “group friends”. I don’t have the same friends as all my friends, and that’s ok (and makes for more interesting parties).

The problem is that this type of engagement detracts from your available attention share, so social media actively discourages it. Instead they want you to be a lonely voice shouting into the void hoping someone will notice you. That’s not a great life.

Gives both the "short commute" benefit of work-from-home, as well as the "maintaining a clear separation between home and work" benefit of on-location-work.

And for me personally (as an introvert), it was fantastic to have people around that I could talk to socially, but who weren't directly involved in my work and who weren't going to make demands of me. Totally removed the feelings of isolation, and formed a bunch of new friendships that didn't rest on obligations to my employer.

FWIW, before the pandemic started, I was not enthusiastic at all about WFH, for various reasons but mostly because I live in a small one room apartment (quite usual here in the inner city in Tokyo). Now, after addressing basic issues to improve the ergonomics of my home office, most of the downsides are gone, and those that remain are outweighed by the prospect of commuting again. Of course, this could easily change if I moved closer to the office (or switched jobs to be physically closer), but considering rent close to the typical business hubs here, that's unattractive financially.

As for isolation: personally, I do a lot of pair programming (whether in the office or remotely), so I don't actually feel isolated at all. If would describe myself as mildly introvert, so YMMV, but I feel like I need to disconnect from people after a day of remote work no more or less than after a regular day at the office.

i wonder if people who feel this way aren't getting socializing done outside of work, and is using work as a form of socialization?

former engineers - that is, they no longer want to be an engineer, but chose the management path. It's quite likely that engineering work is merely a stepping stone for someone like that who intends to advance their career in the management track. I would expect an over-representation of extroverts in this category.

Introverted engineers remain engineers because they like the work, and are only forced out when the pay no longer match their output (but can not move up any more due to the engineering track being "ceiling" compared to the management track).

NormaL WFH under normal conditions looks very different for most, and in many aspects.

This happened without much time to prepare for one thing (e.g. suboptimal desk/office setup), and while everyone else was stuck at home with you, for another.

Don’t try to compare WFH during COVID with WFH when kids are back in school/daycare, and we’re not locked down at home trying to stay healthy.

This. I find it an odd term to use for what is essentially a workplace.

The modern meaning of "Campus" seems to have drifted from a location with multiple facilities where one could actually live, to office with table tennis and free meal facilities.

As someone working at Google, there was never any surprise Google did not announce a permanent WFH solution, since it has not been part of the company culture nor did they put out any expectations you would be able to WFH permanently.

so why exactly shouldn't that be possible!? It's not like the work/output decreased (for the most part). The only legitimate way for compensation to drop should be due to competition - allowing remote should also mean allowing more people to apply for a position, and thus, higher supply of potential workers. This _should_ naturally lower compensation, but not immediately.

> ...we are giving employees the opportunity to elect a Work Mode—whether they’d prefer to work mostly at home or in the office...

https://newsroom.spotify.com/2021-02-12/distributed-first-is...

They also have a 17-year lease on space in 4 World Trade Center.

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-54482245

Disclaimer: I work there.

Personally, I'm still expecting to see a much higher percentage of time spent working from home at this time next year compared to the beginning of 2020.

Remote work basically doesn't change anything for the activities I'd like to do. Mine are centered around major cities, require large amounts of tools and space, or have to be done during the day. Remote isn't a huge factor except for the space being expensive in major cities part. If I have a day-time activity I want to do, remote work does jack shit for that. If I want to go skiing 7-times a week then I'm SOL because work hours are work hours and they overlap with the hours that resorts are open. Until the work you do becomes async by nature - not just remote - a lot of alternative lifestyles are not available. I'm sure the same is true for you as well with climbing. You can get lights and go during the night but I'm sure you'd prefer to climb during the day if you had a choice.

To give you some background, we are an IT shop for an Energy co. so there is a big chunk of our people who have to be at work, physically just because of the nature of the work. As others have alluded, we weren't set up with remote in mind.

I would love to hear how being 100% you've built a network, bonds etc with your colleagues. We have a bunch of new people who dont have the rapport with us or finding it difficult to connect ( a few lunches or coffees, or hang out in the common area could help build )

I should also mentioned the 3 off / 2 in office is something of a peace offering to the non IT part of the business. Most of us know we can be fully remote.

Not just that, many of those normal outlets have been heavily restricted or even not allowed for the past year. I expect if that wasn't the case, people wouldn't put so much of their unhappiness on the work part of being at home all the time.

I just want to walk, read something interesting and eat.

There’s various ways to create tunnels for remote services to talk to local devices, but it adds latency and complexity to an already complex workflow.

I've been 'remote' for... 12 years now, but do travel to offices sometimes, and do enjoy being able to do some face to face time with folks, even sometimes for multiple days or weeks at a stretch. The core matter is who decides when I need to be in an office. If it's me or mostly me, it's great. If it's solely at the discretion of others, that's where problems often are (regardless of whether it's full time or not).

If you’re 50% WFH, you can structure your parental life around the remote days. It’s not that you work less on those days, but the time you would otherwise spend commuting is time you can spend on weekday family things.

Another scenario I’ve seen is people who want a "remote home.” Fed up with the prices for living in a major metropolitan area, or perhaps because they prefer a smaller town and/or living in a rural area, they buy a place with double their usual commute.

That can be brutal, but if you only do that a couple of days of the week, and can structure your F2F work on those days, the total number of hours commuting isn’t so bad.

On your days at home, you can be just as productive as a day in the office without spending a full eight hours locked in your home office space.

Sure, it doesn't allow other things like working from a beach somewhere in Spain. But it's a compromise that keeps many benefits from both solutions.

My post-vaccine plan is to have a "mulmen day" where I set the expectation with my teammates and stakeholders that I am in the office and a "float" day where I come in to align with someone else's day who I need to work with face-to-face for whatever reason. If everyone works this way then we can meet most scheduling needs. If we expand this to two float days a week then it is trivial.

There's no reason for the whole team to be colocated on the same day on a regular basis. Those kind of team-wide meetings never benefit from whiteboarding or any other in-person process. In fact the limitations of remote work make that kind of collaboration better because you have to actually prepare your thoughts and material.

Even pre-covid getting calendar time required a week of notice. Office hours were once-a-week and required at least 24 hours notice. Personally my office hours are on Wednesday. If someone books a session I come in, if not I don't. Nothing changes.

In Covid times I have had the most productive period of my career while my team grew by 50%. I have no problem getting coworker time ad-hoc, even remote. Communication is not difficult. We got better at using tooling to write documents and draw diagrams. We don't use whiteboard analogies.

I honestly see no downside to the remote work and a long list of personal, professional and environmental benefits.

If it's all the same days that'd be great but doesn't seem like it's work for everyone. I know certain days/times where I can't have meetings at home because the space is otherwise occupied and I need to keep quiet etc.

Over the last year I've actually started to connect with my team. We have weekly video chats and spend hours socializing. As an older engineer with bad hearing, video chats are far better than crowding around a big table in a cavernous, modern office.

My only complaint is the environment I have to work in. Silicon Valley real estate is sub-par and high priced. I've been looking for a new apartment with a spare bedroom for months but the only units available are far away or run-down. If I knew I could WFH forever, I'd have left already. Here I am, waiting, because I have no idea when I'll be required to go back to work.

Everyone in my team does literally just that on Slack. If I can say something, I can type something. If I can close my laptop in the office, I can close my laptop at home just the same. Or close Slack. Or just sign out of the company's workspace.

I've worked full remote for almost a decade now. It was hard at first, until I realized there were solutions to the problems I encountered and it would take conscious effort on my part to get it done.

It's definitely possible for remote developers to achieve at least as much productivity as in person devs. But it's also understandable if people/companies don't want to make that effort.

I think this is very subjective. When I carpooled to an office my personal life lost commute time and arriving early or leaving late to coordinate with rides or buses. Gained an extra 8h a week when I went remote.

The personal relationship stuff is tricky, and I think junior folks, and especially fresh grads, got hit pretty hard here. On the flip side, I joined a new team around the time we all went remote last year (with several people I'd never met or heard of before), and it turned out just fine. I wouldn't say I'm buddies with all the new people, but I think we all feel comfortable with and respect each other. I joined in more of a technical leadership role, though, so I can totally get that someone who has to also deal with receiving mentorship could feel a bit overwhelmed and lost.

The work-life balance thing I find very puzzling. Many people (especially in the bay area) have gotten 1-2 hours per day of commute time back from utter waste (though I guess you folks at Google have the buses). Sure, things get blurred when you work at a desk in your bedroom, or at your kitchen table. But this is something that you as a manager need to be on top of by setting an example for the team. Keep reasonable hours, and disconnect outside those hours. Don't hold your team members to deadlines that require them to work excessive hours. When you sign off at 5 or 6pm with your "gotta go, chat tomorrow", make it clear that you expect the rest of the team to sign off pretty soon as well.

Having said that, I do know people in my org that work too much. But they're the kind of people who weren't great at balance back when we were in offices, either.

You can only blame yourself for that. When I'm done working for the day, I log out, lock my screen and walk out of the room. And if the time to go happens in the middle of a chat, then so be it. My boss can tell me he's gotta go, and I can tell him I've gotta go, and that's exactly what we do. There is no blurring of work and life because I don't blur them.

1. All you need to do a remote whiteboard is a microphone and a mouse. This is a great opportunity to create new softwares that actually help collaboration and improve the design process rather than being stuck forever with a pen and a paper.

2. What you call "personal relationship" is, at the end of the day, employee relationship and politic to be promoted. You are in a long term position of power on your employee, which allows you to impose your point of view. Stop pretending to be benevolent. Most new hires do what you tell them to do, it doesn't change with work from home.

3. I think that's just because you are not a good manager (sorry), or your own managers are bad. If you actually cared, you would respect people time and have clear rules that show it. You can send a "have a good afternoon" at 6PM, no one would find that awkward

Then, they’re forced to write their designs down, people read them, and there is a larger meeting to discuss (which usually is only needed for big course corrections).

1. This is your strongest point. I've missed the whiteboard a bit. But you just need to find other ways to sketch out your ideas. Even a google doc, which is pretty primitive as these kinds of things go, it pretty easy to use instead.

2. Personal relationships require investment and deliberate choice. Schedule some open mic time. Keep a zoom room open where teammates can interact but with the expectation that they needn't be 100% engaged. This is a substitute for talking over the cube walls or the random break room interactions. Also spend time in non-work conversations via slack or talk a bit about non-work stuff before or after normal meetings. You'd do this in the office as you walked to or from a meeting room. It isn't as easy to just accidentally build these social relationships. Working remote you need to build the habits that support them.

3. Keep your work space and your personal space separate. Set some time boundaries. Encourage your team to put a cap on their daily work. Remind them. You have to learn set and stick to healthy boundaries. Too much time on the job leads to productivity drop in the long run. Keep your team productive and happy by helping them be aware of the issue. As a manager, watch out for perverse incentives driving overwork.

There are zillion little moments of ad hoc communication that happen face to face. Now that their absence has helped you discover that they are valuable, ask yourself when they occurred and how they worked to your advantage. Once you have some idea what you're missing, then you can start to engineer a replacement. As a leader, it's important that you model these behaviors for your team.

I was kind of hoping the remote work experience would help folks make that sort of inside baseball less important. There are real equity concerns to consider, but practically speaking, you end up with narrower and less open decision-making processes in general.

It's definitely a complicated subject, but maybe some folks are partly missing some privilege that they need to learn to let go.

When we were in the office it was rare to speak with anyone who wasn't on your floor, whereas now it's no harder to work with someone in Stockholm or Berlin than it is in London.

Doing Zoom calls before was always a massive pain as we have an open office (like almost everyone nowadays) and there weren't enough private spaces.

That’s a heck of a sales pitch for Jamboard.

What's stopping someone from just... grabbing a whiteboard? They ain't expensive. Yeah, maybe not everyone can write to it, but everyone should be able to read from it. Designate someone as the writer and you're good to go.

> There's nothing like "gotta go, chat tomorrow" stuff.

What about "Sorry, just broke for $MEAL, let's put it on the calendar for tomorrow"?

Giving it up would mean changing the culture and the value prop of working there. I can’t say I’m surprised they don’t want to do that.

Kinda seems odd too because the only metric that you would think matters (stock price) would have heavy consideration (~90% growth since March 2020).

Remember, this is a company that has had senior executives have extremely real and credible sexual misconduct allegations made against them only to see them sent off with million dollar golden parachutes: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/25/technology/google-sexual-...

You will not win a legal battle against Google, period.

1. Alphabet Workers Union exists.

2. ???

3. Google is forced to return all its workers to in person work during a global pandemic.

The reason Google is bringing people back is to have a united culture, which they need because the NYT is naughty? Not following here.

Same, my team has gone way through the roof in productivity, delivering more than ever. At some point we actually ran out of stories to do even with more work and had to come up with more.

As a note, over than half the team already WFH'd at least 1 day a week in normal conditions, and there was sufficient team trust that everyone would do the right thing, nobody minded if you ran out for errands or lunch unannounced - people would quickly check if any meetings were scheduled usually before running out, items were completed ahead of schedule. I've been doing a 30m-1h nap in the middle of the day and that's helped a lot too.

I've also managed to not catch a cold or flu for the first time ever.

My previous daily commute was min 1-2hrs each way in completely stopped traffic on a standing room only bus/train with multiple transfers and involved waking up even earlier than that to not be refused entry to an overfilled bus.

I've seen a teammate or two be playing actual games (ranked apex legends in this case) during meetings but honestly, they were still responding, answered questions, and that meeting could have been a slack thread but some other teams are not nearly as competent at reading README.md.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/patriciagbarnes/2019/07/20/deja...

EDIT: Forgot to mention they did specifically call out the expense of the location and parking privileges as a reason to disallow remote work.

I didn't bring in the machine, but it was a nice work environment.