A $10k stipend is available for anyone moving to Cumberland, MD
107 points by vxxzy 10 months ago | 176 comments- j_m_b 10 months agoI just got back from a visit with family in Cumberland. It's the epitome of rust belt. What used to be a thriving manufacturing area has become an abandoned service-sector economy with low-wage jobs. Property values are dirt cheap, even for nice houses. There isn't much nearby, you have to travel hours from Pittsburgh to even get there by plane. Tales of theft of items like power tools from relatively remote farms are common. It doesn't look quite as bad as videos I've seen of poorer parts of Appalachia, but it's pretty close. I don't know how they will be able to afford this as the tax base has all but left and Cumberland is trying to pinch every penny they can to afford their over-compensated government staff. It's a pretty sad state of affairs, this seems more like a last-ditch marketing effort.
- robotnikman 10 months agoSounds like a place I wouldn't mind working if I can find a remote position again. I'm a big introvert, and I would like to move somewhere more greener (getting tired of living in the middle of a bland hot dessert)
- ghaff 10 months agoAt some point, many people start thinking about things like access to good healthcare, various types of trades, ability to travel without it being a huge hassle, etc. Doesn't mean you need to live right around a big city but I doubt I would want every task or appointment to be a big undertaking.
- iancmceachern 10 months agoHealthcare is huge. It's amazing how terrible access to good care is in many rural areas. It's something people often overlook but it's just so important.
- j_m_b 10 months agoThis is actually a very good point. The family I visited travel 1hr+ to get healthcare services because the local ones are pretty bad. They're not elderly per se, only a few years into retirement but they definitely have health issues that come with old age. They're relatively well-off and live in the nicer section of Cumberland where doctors and lawyers lived. I can't imagine how bad it is for people who are just getting by.
- 10 months ago
- codersfocus 10 months agoTelemedicine / remote surgery should solve this.
- iancmceachern 10 months ago
- deagle50 10 months agoDon't fall for it. I had family in Cumberland for 20 years and I know it well. It's a very dark place, most people there barely finished high school and drug abuse is really bad.
- riehwvfbk 10 months agoAnd live every day as a mark for a robbery? No thanks.
- ghaff 10 months ago
- scythe 10 months agoThe area around Cumberland, mostly to the south towards Moorefield and Petersburg, WV, has a somewhat similar climate to the Tokaj region of Hungary, known for growing rare botrytized wines that sell for a fortune. I found this one day when I looked at the map of precipitation activity the US and saw an unexpected dry(ish) spot in northeastern West Virginia.
- alephnerd 10 months agoThere's a decently sized saffron industry in that general region of the Appalachia and southern PA for the same reason.
- alephnerd 10 months ago
- dfc 10 months agoCumberland is equidistant (~2 hours) between Pittsburgh airport and Dulles.
- klingoff 10 months agoThey sound about the same, but "2 Hours to Dulles" would be the better name for the M Night Shyamalan movie.
- fragmede 10 months ago2 Hours from Allegheny County would be a David Fincher flic.
- fragmede 10 months ago
- abduhl 10 months agoI think this would be equitemporal rather than equidistant? Maybe isochronic? Isochronal? One of those…
- mdp2021 10 months agoEquidistant in time.
Edit: speak up, annoyant... "Distance" is "standing apart". It is not confined to space - in fact, the original meaning is that of "diverging in stances" (i.e. a quarrel), and the geometric one comes one century later. And there exist languages where speaking of "distance in time" is language in use - so, if in your neighborhood they don't speak this way, it is a problem of your neighborhood.
- mdp2021 10 months ago
- ApolloFortyNine 10 months ago2 hours from a central hub I'd actually consider a plus. If you travel for work it's bad, but for any personal trip, skipping a connection is pretty valuable. Not just in time, but generally international / longer flights are higher priority, and are less likely to be randomly delayed or canceled.
- ghaff 10 months agoI was on the far edge of relatively convenient airport access when I was working and traveling a lot (and, at some point, decided my employer was just going to pay for a private car whether they complained or not, which they didn't). Now I travel somewhat less but take fewer discrete trips so just pay my own transportation out of pocket.
- ghaff 10 months ago
- deagle50 10 months agoNot quite true for Dulles. You're looking at 3 hours in good traffic, and it's not a relaxing drive. BWI could be done in 2.5 hours and you don't have to deal with the two way road from Frederick to Leesburg.
- klingoff 10 months ago
- thelastparadise 10 months agoNot to mention "incest" is a real word there. It is most definitely Appalachia, part of the dark underbelly.
Drive down any number of the "hollars," and you'll see an active smokehouse, yard litter, and an (often abused) wife sitting on the porch.
There are neighborhood kids endlessly circling the streets. An otherwise innocuous occurrence, however in this case the child is pushing 30 years old.
- rjsw 10 months agoHow good is internet access there?
- fasa99 10 months agoIf you're in cumberland proper, your main option is cable, which is fine, fast and stable. since the culture is blue collar, their lineman due a perfectionist tier type guys who pride themselves in their craft. they have a guy there who does fibre and is pretty chill but ironically he only runs line rurally (not in the main urban core of cumberland). they have a startup-ish grass roots wireless based internet which is cool but kind of hard to plug into.
They also have various speakeasies fully in the classic unlicensed since but for obvious reasons I won't say where. I would call it a "deregulated" region. Whereas in most of MD you have vehicle emissions and all that redtape, none of it in cumberland.
there are methheads about but police force and community are hand in hand and highly functional
if you're in cumberland proper all you could want is walkable, including an amtrak station that links you directly to DC and chicago, walking distance
there is an aspect of xenophobia but generally if you live there a while, well, if you're willing to live in cumberland that's good enough for most people to welcome you. it does have a small town vibe as far as saying hello to everyone on the sidewalk as such
the other point people who visit may miss about appalachian culture (it is appalachian culture very much so, not maryland culture) is everyone dresses like a methhead, even people who aren't methheads, so take appearences softly.
- tunesmith 10 months agoThe brochure says "95% broadband", whatever that means.
- bee_rider 10 months agoPresumably the last 5% is the bit that connects to your computer.
- jacoblambda 10 months agoThat generally means most properties will have decent broadband/>25mbps internet, some will have ADSL <25mbps, and a few won't have internet or you'll have to run it to the property (costs a few thousand USD generally).
- speed_spread 10 months agoThe missing 5% was stolen by copper thieves.
- bee_rider 10 months ago
- reducesuffering 10 months ago70% of households in the county have internet speeds >25 Mbps. Is that metric meaningful to you? What would ideally mean "good internet access?"
I'm working on a project[0] where I sourced this from the FCC Broadband data and am curious about what people are looking for in that respect.
[0] https://www.exoroad.com/us/Maryland/Allegany-County/housing
- kjellsbells 10 months agoFirst, if you aren't already, look into what the FCC is doing with BEAD funding, and consequently what all the states are doing with mapping broadband provision to try and capture some of that money. Tennesee for example.
More generally, there is a little funkiness with the exoroad site. I guess this project is still in the assembly stage?
- When I search for a US county, say Culpeper or Fairfax in Virginia, I get the map and then some very stock images. The images are on things that don't exist in the specific county. E.g. Fairfax doesn't have a cathedral and a giant stately home.
- The crime stats are also a bit weirdly presented. If a county is "9 of 10" for crime that makes it sound terrible...but I think you render it in green to show that it's good? And what does the statistic actually mean? "out of 10 equivalently populated counties?" say, or something else?
- Barrin92 10 months ago> What would ideally mean "good internet access?"
For someone who relies on a internet connection for their professional work I'd say 100 Mbps is the floor of "good" in 2024. I think that's what the FCC updated their definition of broadband to earlier this year.
- kavok 10 months agoUpload, download, latency, and how many options to choose from are what I looked for the last time I bought a house.
I actually asked some of the neighbors about it and called local ISPs.
- KennyBlanken 10 months agoWhen I looked at the claimed coverage map from providers it was a joke - they just played "color inside the lines" for our region. Ask anyone who has spent more than a couple days here and they can tick off all the areas you don't get any coverage.
- kjellsbells 10 months ago
- jhawk28 10 months agoYou can get always get starlink if the fiber/cable is bad.
- KennyBlanken 10 months agoSure, if you don't mind regular drops while you're handed off between satellites, and many areas being oversubscribed so badly that people are getting performance worse than DSL.
- KennyBlanken 10 months ago
- xeromal 10 months agoWith Starlink, this question is getting less important. Loads of my family in N. Georgia have started using it and it's crazy how much better it is than the local competition
- op00to 10 months agoStarlink still sucks for remote work. Every time the satellites switch there is a slight disconnection, causing interruption to Zoom meetings.
- op00to 10 months ago
- fasa99 10 months ago
- dccoolgai 10 months agoWhen the railroad was the internet, it was really the Silicon Valley of its day. Really makes you think.
- hosh 10 months agoI had been thinking about looking at history from the lens of information technology.
China is an interesting example, in that it was so well ahead of the curve until around 1700s. In the 1800s, when telegraphs were connecting the Western world together, the Qing dynasty China would not have been able to participate unless pictographs could be encoded as easily as letters (let alone the century of uprisings, rebellions, and civil war).
But look at Tang Dynasty China. The Silk Road was a part of a global trade network reaching through the Middle East, and into Africa, along with maritime routes from India.
It wasn’t just trade goods that travelled. Ideas — religious, cultural, technological, flowed along the network. But they travelled only as fast as trade goods.
I think it is when information is able to flow faster than the physical items that, we might find some insights about what is going on now.
- dfedbeef 10 months agoI have good news re: information flow rates
- dfedbeef 10 months ago
- samstave 10 months agoMaybe youre not familiar with Qwest Communications?
Man does SV have stories to tell that will be lost to us old BOFH ilk:
Qwest communications came about when the railroad realized they had rights to the easement lanes on either side of ALL their train tracks, that allowed them to basically do anything they wanted with that strip of land.
So Qwest Communications was born to run fiber along all the tracks and built a huge fiber infra.
There was a huge scandal with the telecom giants, and Qwest's CEO was convicted:
---
Dossier: Qwest Communications
Creation and Early Years
- Qwest Communications was formed in 1996 as a spin-off from the Southern Pacific Railroad Company. The railroad company had been granted easement rights to lay fiber-optic cables along their tracks, which Qwest leveraged to build a massive fiber-optic network.
Fiber-Optic Network Expansion
- Qwest used the easement rights to lay fiber-optic cables along the railroad tracks, expanding their network across the western United States. This strategic move allowed Qwest to:
- Reduce costs: By utilizing existing railroad easements, Qwest avoided the need to purchase or lease land for their fiber-optic cables.
- Increase efficiency: The railroad tracks provided a direct route for fiber-optic cables, reducing the need for detours and minimizing signal degradation.
Scandal and Conviction of CEO Joseph Nacchio
- In 2005, Qwest CEO Joseph Nacchio was convicted of insider trading and sentenced to six years in prison. The scandal involved Nacchio selling millions of dollars' worth of Qwest stock while aware of the company's financial struggles.
Scale of Fiber Plant
- Qwest built an extensive fiber-optic network, spanning over 190,000 miles across the United States. This massive infrastructure enabled Qwest to offer high-speed data and voice services to customers.
- mgerdts 10 months agoThis sounds a lot like the story of Sprint (Southern Pacific Railroad INTernet?). If I were less lazy I bet I could find the story where this part of Sprint morphed into Qwest.
- fragmede 10 months agoYou missed the part where the Qwest refused to participate in illegal surveillance and the NSA destroyed the company for it.
https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2007/10/qwest-ceo-nsa-punished...
- dirtyhippiefree 10 months agoReply to mgerdts: The acronym is actually Southern Pacific Railroad Internal Network Telecommunications according to NPR.
https://www.npr.org/2012/10/15/162963607/sprint-born-from-ra...
- mgerdts 10 months ago
- thephyber 10 months agoCategorical mistake.
A rural community based on a single industry is always high risk for economic sustainability.
Silicon Valley is has cities older than the USA, was grown by the gold rush, the early movie studios, the defense industry (plus some world class universities), NASA contractors, microelectronics, etc. The most recent iteration is software startups.
Cities are always more resilient than isolated rural communities because they are inherently more diversified in both economy and workforce.
- mturmon 10 months agoExcellent point.
Longnow.org has a lot of material about the resilience of cities over very long time scales (like, millennia).
Here’s an example on the resilience of cities versus corporations: https://longnow.org/seminars/02011/jul/25/why-cities-keep-gr...
Another example, from a longnow podcast, is the tendency of people to think of themselves as citizens of a particular city (I’m from San Francisco, I’m from Venice, I’m from Helsinki), perhaps even more so than a state/province or a nationality in some cases.
- mturmon 10 months ago
- tonymet 10 months agoAnd makes you humble.
- hosh 10 months ago
- martinald 10 months agoSeems like its 2hrs drive from Pittsburg and IAD airports?
- robotnikman 10 months ago
- radpanda 10 months agoAs a native Marylander I always find myself forgetting about Cumberland, which is a shame. As someone who has mostly lived in and around Baltimore, you head west to Frederick (aka Fredneck) for the small city in the middle of rural farmland. If you keep heading west you get to Hagerstown which feels way out there in farm country. And if you keep heading west you eventually move from farms to mountains and you hit Cumberland, which looks like a city that time forgot.
As other folks have commented, there’s some beautiful architecture and the old part of the city seems like it could be a bustling place. There’s a train station and easy access to the great outdoors. But the jobs have long gone and drug addiction has taken root for so many there. I don’t know the best way to revive a place like that but I hope something eventually works.
- devchix 10 months agoAnd if you travel farther west on 70, you'll eventually reach Wheeling, WVA. At one time its position on the Ohio river and near railroads made it a transportation hub, it made money in iron, textile, and logging - they used to float logs down the river. The vestige of wealth is still visible in its architecture, beautiful brick homes, ornate porches, windows and roofs. It's this glimmer into this past, not so far in the distance, that is so sad to witness. A lot of the town has fallen into disrepair, not slum exactly, but heading there. There is a central market building with some kitschy arts and crafts, and food stalls that supply tour buses. The buses come for Wheeling Island Casino, which has one of the last two remaining greyhound racetracks in the US. There's some attempt at preserving the historic buildings and downtown. People keep leaving, and the tourist attractions are more of a detour stop than a destination point. There used to be a pie stall - best pies in the US, handmade, fresh ingredients, $15, baked to order by a retired teacher. He sold the shop, his kids didn't want it, it was too much work and they made more money doing other things.
- nunez 10 months agoI drove by Wheeling on my way to Texas from Maine. Literally looked like a city that was one great but is now dying. Very sad stuff. Apparently they are revitalizing downtown though.
- nunez 10 months ago
- stackskipton 10 months agoSure, but problem Cumberland has same problem as rest of Appalachia, it's geography isn't very good. Mountain areas make everything 10x times harder to build.
Let's say some big software company wanted to build second HQ. Even if Cumberland was attractive in workforce, education options and so forth, the architects would say "Building your HQ2 is going to be rough. There isn't enough flat land, flooding could be problematic, fiber companies are screaming about the trenching" Not to mention, where are you going to put all your workers since housing will run into same problem. So if you wanted to stay in MD, somewhere like Hagerstown or Salisbury would be a better choice since usable land is plentiful.
- AlotOfReading 10 months agoIf there was an economy worth building for, the geography wouldn't be a blocker. Look at Seattle, Oakland, or the Hollywood hills. They're all built on rugged, mountainous terrain just as difficult as the Appalachians, but they don't suffer the same issues attracting wealth because their economic situation is so different. In fact, each of them has the opposite problem of demand to build vastly outstripping permission to build.
- stackskipton 10 months ago>Look at Seattle, Oakland, or the Hollywood hills. They're all built on rugged, mountainous terrain just as difficult as the Appalachians, but they don't suffer the same issues attracting wealth because their economic situation is so different.
Wrong. Seattle, Oakland and Los Angeles are mostly built on much flatter parts of those areas. California entire geography is about "Hey, check out these massive valleys or coastal land we can build in." Same thing with Washington State, Seattle is in between Cascades and Olympics where there is all this flat land to build on. Yes, they running out of land and building into mountains now. That problem is like having FAANG scaling problems. It sucks but it's good/manageable problem to have and you have massive checkbooks to help solve it.
Have you been to Appalachia? It's not on the coast and does not have these benefits. If you want to compare it to West Coast areas, it's more like Sierra Nevada. Inland Mountains with only small valleys to build infrastructure in.
- stackskipton 10 months ago
- dullcrisp 10 months agoBut people live there already. Couldn’t they be prosperous without a big software company building its headquarters there?
- AlotOfReading 10 months ago
- lotsofpulp 10 months ago>I don’t know the best way to revive a place like that but I hope something eventually works.
You don’t. Times change, and what used to provide utility may no longer provide utility, and the only option is to move on.
- devchix 10 months ago
- tonymet 10 months agoExtrinsic monetary incentives are among the worst ways to stimulate growth. Anyone who would uproot their life for $10k is likely not the right personality to restore prosperity.
Other strategies have worked to gentrify depressed neighborhoods, like attracting bohemians or entrepreneurs with lower rents and tax relief, based on a strict qualification process.
- QuantumGood 10 months agoIt's not just the 10K, it's an advertisement for low-cost homes, e.g. https://www.zillow.com/cumberland-md/?searchQueryState=%7B%2...
- plaidfuji 10 months agoMaryland is full of places like this. Beautiful exterior, super solid construction.
But on the inside, brittle plaster walls (hard to hang anything), lead paint covered by about 1/4 inch of repeated repainting, finicky radiant heating, sparse electrical outlets usually ungrounded, 100 year old plumbing, literally zero central air or proper ventilation anywhere (= upper levels are a sauna… look for a single HVAC grate anywhere), legacy window and door hardware that can’t be replaced… the list goes on. Every improvement project risks disrupting decades of toxic building materials and carefully grandfathered code violations.
- martinald 10 months agoIt's really not a big deal to strip that all back and redo it all. It's much easier that way round than taking a badly constructed "newer" house actually making it solid.
In the UK houses of that type are the standard and renovated all the time.
- martinald 10 months ago
- plaidfuji 10 months ago
- fasa99 10 months agocumberland is already quite bohemian. 20k for free, and some houses can be had for that amount, is quite appealing to the home-owning bohemian. the only trick of it - said bohemian probably would need a remote job. not much locally. so the obvious play is to make it a remote paradise and focus the remainder of the economy on supporting both the essentials and the entertainment / night life of said remote worker
- soared 10 months agoYeah many of the other similar incentives provide free land, housing/internet/etc benefits too
- silisili 10 months agoThis is what I thought of. 10k is nothing. I'd break even or actually come out behind just on their income taxes alone.
But say, 10 acres of land, with utility access/hookups? I may really consider it. By offering free land, with requirement that you build a stick house and live in it, you can ensure whoever is moving there has funds to build a house.
- silisili 10 months ago
- QuantumGood 10 months ago
- ckcheng 10 months agoFrom the linked page:
> The package, offering up to $20,000 is comprised of $10,000 in relocation cash, PLUS up to $10,000, dollar for dollar match, for approved renovations on an existing home, OR for a down payment on a newly constructed home within City limits.
Not “A $10k stipend is available for anyone moving to Cumberland, MD” as the submission title says currently , which sounded like a basic income.
- ta988 10 months agoExactly. And they are going to reassess your property because you did renovations and get more than the $20k they gave you over time. Not even talking about the local taxes if you get a job there.
- ta988 10 months ago
- Nifty3929 10 months agoSounds like a gift to current residents who want to leave: "...receive $10,000.00 (“Program Incentive”) payable at closing of a home or upon proof closing has occurred... " Meaning that it will help prop up prices for those selling.
AND/OR a gift for their local construction workers: "... receive up to $10,000, dollar for dollar match, for approved renovations ... on an existing home ... or for a down payment on a newly constructed home ..."
- khuey 10 months agoOne of the program requirements is that you buy a house there and live in it for five years.
- anticorporate 10 months agoThis is pretty important. I suspect the people who are motivated by $2k a year to move there are not the people who are going to be bringing a large influx of capital to a place that very much needs it.
Although actually, it looks like there are two separate programs, which you can be eligible for both of: The relocation credit, and the restoration or down payment credit, which is more of a match, so the actual amount is more like $20k total.
- delichon 10 months ago> I suspect the people who are motivated by $2k a year to move there are not the people who are going to be bringing a large influx of capital to a place that very much needs it.
You are correct, they are the people who will be available to be employed by those considering bringing a large influx of capital and taxable revenue. They're the bait.
- klingoff 10 months agoOffering $10-20k to move somewhere that doesn't have jobs isn't going to build a labor market. Retirees and remote workers can decide to live in a labor nowhere to stretch their house buying power, lower cost of living, etc.
- klingoff 10 months ago
- delichon 10 months ago
- j_m_b 10 months agoThat actually explains a lot. They are trying to expand their tax base. The improvements stipend will allow them to assess the property at a higher value!
- more_corn 10 months agoBut houses there cost about a nickel.
- yergi 10 months ago...and at the current admin's burn rate of almost 10% GDP deficit / year via printing of money, that 10K gonna be worth more like 5k at the present clip in 5 years. Honestly, reducing gov't spending by 50% to fit within the confines of the tax base simply isn't going to happen. So, with that in mind, that 5k (in future real terms) to move to a state with terrible rental laws for landlords (if that's the long term goal) just simply doesn't make any sense at all.
- PaulDavisThe1st 10 months agoThere is no linear relationship between national debt and inflation. There is no possible way to conclude that because of any particular change in the deficit or debt that $1 today will be worth more or less in 5 years. You don't know, and neither does anybody else.
- PaulDavisThe1st 10 months ago
- anticorporate 10 months ago
- billsmithaustin 10 months agoFor you cyclists, the Great Allegheny Pass trail and the Chesapeake & Ohio towpath meet there.
- tantalor 10 months agoAlso has an Amtrak station!
- op00to 10 months agoHow many trains a day?
- trollbridge 10 months agoCUM has a train headed for DC show up once a day at 9:30am. Takes 3½ hours, which is about an hour longer than driving.
In the other direction to Pittsburgh leaves at 7:30pm and takes 4½ hours, more than 2 hours longer than driving.
- smhg 10 months agoNot even one per day as far as I can tell.
The Amtrack website also mentions:
Known as Maryland's “Queen City,” Cumberland was an early gateway to the West. Today, it is a bustling arts center and popular stopover for cyclists using the trail network between Pittsburgh and Washington, D.C.
- trollbridge 10 months ago
- op00to 10 months ago
- ktosobcy 10 months agoEh... I'm always mind-blown by the amazing nature the USA has... :(
- tantalor 10 months ago
- jt2190 10 months agoI've created a Google Sheet to list these programs. Got three so far. Please feel free to add any that you know of. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1ahY6cI0CJVbK9PRNIkjh...
- solid_fuel 10 months agoI suspect these programs are mostly an attempt to claw back some people lost to the brain-drain that the region has been experiencing for decades. $10k over 5 years is not enough to seriously convince most people with no ties to the area to relocate there.
I have family roots in Cumberland and the nearby areas of West Virginia and MD and I still wouldn't consider moving back. But, if you still have a good relationship with family in the city and were already considering the move, this offer might look more compelling.
I believe Vermont also had a similar program for several years - offering a similar amount of money for people to move and work there in VT.
- lizknope 10 months agohttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cumberland,_Maryland#Demograph...
Historical population
peak was
1940 39,483
2020 19,076
It is still dropping
The racial makeup of the city was 89.4% White, 6.4% African American, 0.2% Native American, 0.9% Asian, 0.1% Pacific Islander, 0.3% from other races, and 2.8% from two or more races. Hispanic or Latino people of any race were 1.2% of the population.
I wish them luck but I don't want to live there.
- Aspos 10 months agoThere is a dedicated bicycle road connecting Cumberland with the National Mall in D.C. and which promises no cars, no pedestrians. Ten hours of pedaling mostly downhill.
- jcranmer 10 months agoThat's the C&O canal towpath which, uh, there's definitely pedestrians there in places (I've done several hikes on portions of it). True about no cars, though.
- philipwhiuk 10 months agoOne-way sure.
- jcranmer 10 months ago
- AndrewHampton 10 months agoA similar program exists for 4 towns in West Virginia: https://ascendwv.com
- nunobrito 10 months agoI've personally enjoyed that kind of offer. My work is remote, my family isn't.
Not living in the US myself, but done similar in EU.
Living outside large cities is a plus factor these days. You can afford a house, commodities tend to be cheaper or you just grow them yourself. Kids go to a local school where you know everyone else, they make strong friendships and grow healthy in nature.
- varjag 10 months agoAs anything else in life it's an individual balance. Knowing everyone can be as much a disadvantage; commodities can be cheaper but your earning potential can also be lower. The nearest airport could be several hours drive, and the only school around where all kids go sounds great until your kid gets bullied.
- varjag 10 months ago
- KennyBlanken 10 months agoYou could not pay me to live in a city whose staff write the phrase "before the time of Christ" in the "about us" for the city's website.
- jeffbee 10 months agoSimilar long-standing program in Tulsa. https://www.tulsaremote.com/
- xyst 10 months agoHave to live in Cumberland, MD for 5 years though.
Borders West Virginia and a key city in the Appalachian area. Some would say this region was day 0 of the opioid epidemic. As of 2020 census, population is largely (~89%) identified as Caucasian. Diversity is lacking. Median income reported at $45K.
Don’t know much besides what’s on paper, but I highly doubt most people on HN would integrate well here.
- brucelidl 10 months agoWow, this is fascinating, my family is originally from Cumberland (actually Frostburg, but...). My mom was born and raised there, but left as soon as she could. Everybody did, and I don't think anyone from my family has been back there since my grandmother died decades ago.
It's really the eastern edge of Appalachia, but also very much a rust belt relic that depended on industries that are long, long gone (at least from that region). I think Kelly tires had a plant there when my mom was younger.
I've always wanted to go back and see it, just to compare it with my memories. It was in pretty steep decline already in the 70s and 80s, as even a kid could tell. I remember reading that they built a number of prisons nearby, also some across the border in Pennsylvania, but clearly that has not done enough to revitalize things.
- khaki54 10 months agoIt's a nice place, especially if you are outdoorsy, due to proximity to so much woodland and trail. I was very surprised with the architecture there. I've only stayed a couple nights (Trailhead for the Ragnar relay series)
- 10 months ago
- kkfx 10 months agoI honestly do not get such programs, I'm from EU where equivalent programs exists in slightly different form (1€ old and abandoned homes for sale) and that's a total stupid initiative because people face MUCH bigger costs and still have no potential development in place.
Instead of proposing such gifts state a complete development programs: how do you count to augment the population enough to create room for a local bustling economy? A possible timeline and the current state of things? Tell me about local climate, hydro-geological stability, pollution and so on. You want people, convince them to be part of you project do not "buy them with candies". Convincing people to be part of a project means finding (if you succeed, of course) active people who can bring value to your community, otherwise you might collect some fool who will go soon or will remain as a burden to the community.
- everforward 10 months agoThose things are all pretty easily Googleable for anyone interested. Honestly, I would expect most people in the US to be able to answer most of those questions with reasonable accuracy without Googling.
The candies are to offset the downsides currently preventing people from moving there. Given its Appalachia, those downsides are probably a) bad, poorly maintained infrastructure, b) lack of jobs, c) lack of proximity to anything, and d) the surrounding poverty.
A lot of Appalachia struggles because the towns were built around a profitable industry, which then died. The town still has all that infra, but now has none of the tax base to pay for it.
They’re probably fine with someone who wants to build a McMansion they never leave, as long as they pay their tax bill and buy groceries in town to support local jobs. They honestly mostly need money. Appalachia is well known for their sense of community already, but also for their poverty.
- everforward 10 months ago
- bcx 10 months agoCumberland also happens to be where the Chesapeake and Ohio canal tow path terminates, and is a really nice 168 mile mostly off road dirt bike ride all the way to Washington DC. It has been extended all the way to Pittsburgh. So if you were into biking, Cumberland could be kind of a cool place to hang out.
- ChrisMarshallNY 10 months ago> Average summer temperature 72.6 degrees Fahrenheit
Must be different, out there. I lived in MD for over ten years, and the average was ... slightly higher ...
It is real purdy, out there, though.
- silisili 10 months agoThey're taking the entire mean over the summertime, which isn't a useful metric IMO. If your days are 90, and your nights 60, you mean out around 75, despite it never really being 75 during the day where you can enjoy it. The average high in July is in the high 80s, which I think matches the entire region pretty closely.
- silisili 10 months ago
- angellonunez 10 months agoIt looks like a nice place. I know about a few similar programs in some towns in Europe. It is interesting to see something like this in some towns and cities in the US.
- ApolloFortyNine 10 months agoGreat camping in this area, and it's a stop on the 300 some mile trail between DC and Pittsburgh (being extended to Erie, eventually).
- francisofascii 10 months agoWork from home. Commute into a DC metro based office once a month. You could even drive to Martinsburg and take the Marc. Sounds doable.
- xyst 10 months ago> Commute into a DC metro based office once a month
Not even once. Have you ever driven in DC metro? No thanks.
- solid_fuel 10 months agoFrom Cumberland, you can take the Amtrak. It's a 3 1/2 hour ride, you can eat on the train, and there's no traffic.
$38 for a round-trip ticket.
- pessimizer 10 months agoThe Marc drops you off in the DC Metro (the subway).
Which on first reading I thought you were referring to with "DC metro," and I got very confused.
- solid_fuel 10 months ago
- xyst 10 months ago
- PLenz 10 months agoMost significant for being the home of Dr. McNinja
- spacemadness 10 months agoIt seems like Zillow is full of people selling houses at 2x to 3x the estimate in Cumberland hoping to sell and run to whoever takes advantage of the relocation program. I see houses assessed at $90,000 in 2023 selling for $300,000. Give me a break.
- streptomycin 10 months ago"Assessed" doesn't mean much, there are many towns (such as my current town, and many others here in NJ) where houses all sell for a similar premium over the official assessed value.
- FireBeyond 10 months agoThe next question there would be how many of them had recently bought those properties - i.e. did they have a heads up from their friends on the City Council that this was coming down the line?
- streptomycin 10 months ago
- calmbonsai 10 months agoIn the post WW2 era, have any of these direct stipend programs been successful?
- kragen 10 months agoone-time payment, not a yearly stipend forever
- throwaway984393 10 months agoIt is a gorgeous area. Not a bad deal if you live in the region and are looking to buy a $120k home
- samstave 10 months agoWTH marketing much?
Read the fn offer:
They will give you $10,000 cash, plus another $10,000 toward a renovation to a house you buy, or to a down-payment on a house you are required to buy, with a value of >$150K that you are required to live in for 5 years.
And you have to apply, and be approved, and undergo a casual interview by the city council.
And you have to be ready to move in within 6 months of approval.
And you have to be fully remote, have a local job, or be moving to cumberland in acceptance of a job...
----
They GIVE YOU NO FN REASON WHY you would want to move there.
The municipal website is a "Parks & Rec Fisher Price" as it comes, where the first link on "Populat links" is "Pay utilities"
There are no posted bid offereings (meaning no active project cumberland is seeking RFPs on)
And community events is barren...
So, why is this on HN?
It doesnt even give a nice GPT synpsis of what the heck cumberland is even about - Here, I GPTd it for them:
https://i.imgur.com/mueJp1W.png
https://i.imgur.com/scpNTid.png
Is my math wrong or something? Did anyone actually look at the image?
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Back when Detroit was doing super bad, and lots for huge Victorian and other nice architecture homes were going for ~$5,000 - there was a lot of chatter of a bunch of millenial-ish techies buy up a bunch of plots and start a tech-commune sort of adventure out there. (turned out the person organizing that effort was pulling a huge grift)
Maybe try to do a YC startup fund where "Hey heres free housing internet and utilities for your startup if you can prove "XYZ" -- like what about a visa program if some Hackers can come in and do a startup there and raise the economy where the city is invested in the startups? But have the program vetted by some panel of experts the city recruits
- zoklet-enjoyer 10 months agoThis could be attractive to people like my brother and his girlfriend. His job is remote and she's going to school for an art degree, mostly into ceramics and wood turning. They love the outdoors and this would be a good spot for them.
- memcg 10 months agoFrostburg State University, Deep Creek Lake and Wisp Resort are close. Summer temperature was 10 degrees F cooler than my house near DC the last time I spent a week at Deep Creek.
- samstave 10 months agoYeah, I got down boted -- but I was making the point that CUmberland didnt even do a fn GPT splat at an attempt to market this.
Heck - any retire-age level techie person with a passsive income/ability to do things remote etc could take this up
But the 20K to live there for five years, and youre required to put 10K of that toward a house that must be >150K
Here are all the listing on Zillow for houses 150K to 200K in/around cumberland md
- deadlydose 10 months ago> didnt even do a fn GPT splat
Do us a favor and run your comments through it next time. And drop the whole crybaby "bots" crap.
- forvelin 10 months agoyou got downvotes because your replies lack manners.
- deadlydose 10 months ago
- memcg 10 months ago
- zoklet-enjoyer 10 months ago
- whalesalad 10 months agoMaryland is so bad they need to pay you 10k to move there. I used to live in Nova and crossing into Maryland was always a drag.
- brigade 10 months agoCumberland has more in common with everything west of the Shenandoah than any part of Maryland you likely drove to.
- dgfitz 10 months agoDid you know that Columbia, MD is consistently voted one of the best cities in the country in which to live and work?
- TylerE 10 months agoColumbia and Cumberland are about as opposite as you can get.
You might as well say “San Francisco is one of the greatest cities on earth, so you should move to Bakersfield.”
- dgfitz 10 months agoGP said “ Maryland is so bad…”
You made the same point I was making, not sure if you realize that.
- dgfitz 10 months ago
- TylerE 10 months ago
- brigade 10 months ago
- Almondsetat 10 months agoMining towns are one of the examples of human hubris and stupidity I can't get my head around. If you build something in a shitty place just because there is a single resource you can sell, and everything else you have to import, then what do you expect will happen when said resource dries up? These places were meant for people to go temporarily, make serious money, and then go back to the city or countryside to build a life there, just like people who go to oil rigs do. Instead people brought their families and created an entire town or city in the middle of nowhere.
Now, the past is past and what's done is done. Can't we just acknowledge this basic reality and let these places die and move to better ones? Maybe thanks to the internet one day they will be repopulated by small tech companies operating from a single building with 100 computers and a fiber network, but until then why bullshit ourselves?
- tetromino_ 10 months agoDeep-sea oil rigs don't grow into towns because there is no spare land to grow on - the "land" is an insanely expensive man-made structure whose size pushes against the limits of human engineering ability. But when oil is found on dry land or even in the sea close to shore, oil industry almost always results in significant urban growth - e.g. see Baku, Los Angeles, or Dubai.
- keiferski 10 months agoCumberland was founded as a fort and a transportation hub first and only later became a mining town.
- PaulDavisThe1st 10 months agoPrecisely correct. It is/was located next to one of the most convenient points to embark on a crossing of the Appalachians.
- PaulDavisThe1st 10 months ago
- overstay8930 10 months agoBecause people wanted to have families? Like what kind of question is this? Do you think people should put their whole life on pause for a job?
- matteoraso 10 months agoIn the olden days, these towns wouldn't pay you money, they would pay you scrip issued by the mining company[0]. This could only be used at company-operated stores, so miners were imprisoned in the towns. Moving back literally wasn't an option for the people that worked there, but if there was no other jobs around, where else could you go?
- 10 months ago
- tetromino_ 10 months ago
