Getting by on the Generosity of Strangers in Japan

85 points by ilamont 1 week ago | 48 comments
  • forgotoldacc 1 week ago
    One consequence of "Japanese hospitality" being widely known is that there are now swathes of tourists visiting with the expectation of getting their own "magical experience".

    Some people living in places that have become tourist areas are putting up signs announcing their home toilets are not for public use. Because apparently some tourists have said things like "When I needed to use the bathroom and there was nowhere else around, I knocked on a random person's door and they were kind enough to let me use it!" So now a non-zero number of people go there with the expectation that they can (and possibly should) do the same.

    Tourists used to be a novelty to Japanese. Now with over 40 million projected for this year, a massive rise from about 6 million in 2012, a large number of them taking extended vacations (in contrast to Euros who might hop a border for a weekend and boost tourist counts quickly), people are getting quickly burnt out with the entitlement many of them exhibit. To tourists, it's a magical, unique vacation and they must have the Ghibli experience someone else posted about. To locals, countless people are harassing you everyday demanding unreasonable things.

    • GuB-42 1 week ago
      Also note that the article is about a guesthouse. It is a business and you pay for the service. It is not about getting inside random people homes because whoever is living there is too polite to kick you out.

      The old lady in the article is so kind and polite because she respects you as a customer, takes pride in her job, and wants you to feel at ease. Service tradition really is something there. But don't get things wrong, it is still a business relationship.

      • srvmshr 1 week ago
        > Some people living in places that have become tourist areas are putting up signs announcing their home toilets are not for public use.

        I read that on r/Tokyo Reddit as well a while back. Quite shocking. It was some person complaining living near a large public park (possibly Shinjuku or Inokashira) about his personal premises being violated because toilet queues were quite long & people kept knocking at their door. Not sure if we both are referring to the same incident?

        [For reference to others, there are enough portable toilets in these public parks to deal with tourist surge, but obviously no arrangement can handle 25000+ visitors everyday without having queues]

        More ridiculous stories have popped up once in a while in japan tourist subreddits. This sakura blossom season, a British tourist couple were seeking legal recourse to avoid detention and move back to their home country ASAP after running over an elderly woman with the rental car. Some people probably don't take consequences in a tourist destination seriously.

        • MichaelZuo 1 week ago
          The latter case sounds more like mental derangement under stress.

          I really doubt even lower ranking actual diplomats could reasonably expect to get away with running over an elderly Japanese grandma in Japan.

          Nearly all the smaller countries would waive even up to a minister-counsellor’s immunity in that scenario.

      • dfxm12 1 week ago
        tourists visiting with the expectation of getting their own "magical experience".

        Having unrealistic expectations go unfulfilled sounds like what a lot of Japanese tourists feel about Paris: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paris_syndrome

        I also think tourists, as a class, tend to be more entitled than others. They usually have money and also having spent money, they expect hospitality on their terms (realistically or not).

        FWIW, I had a recent trip to Japan before news of issues with tourists, and I would describe my experience as "magical", not because of generosity of strangers though. None was needed. Naoshima in particular is magical on its own.

        • adrianN 1 week ago
          Tourism reliably destroys places. Southern Italy is another example where the sheer masses of tourists have completely ruined a whole area.
          • matwood 1 week ago
            Italy is a lot like most places in the EU where tourists visit a few Instagram sites and nothing else. I think it’s incorrect to say it’s ruining southern Italy when the reality is it’s a few areas.

            I was just at the Louvre where the wing with the Mona Lisa was overrun - the busiest I’ve ever seen it. The other wings were almost ghost towns.

            I understand that when people travel they want to see the highlights, but I wish they would also explore a bit.

            https://ca.finance.yahoo.com/news/surging-travel-europe-spik...

            • abtinf 1 week ago
              The Mona Lisa gets over run, while the room holding the the code of Hammurabi(!!!) is basically deserted.
              • seatac76 1 week ago
                I remember going to the Louvre into the room with a Mona Lisa and being surprised by two things:

                - How small the actual painting is, I always imagined it to be bigger.

                - And the sea of heads between the entrance and the panting, there was no way I could get to the front to admire it up close.

                The rest of the museum though was lovely to walk around in.

              • mslansn 1 week ago
                Southern Italy has nothing else to offer, so it's either that or live off the rest of the country. (Yes, I know many would be happy to just do that)
                • tecleandor 1 week ago
                  Nothing else except for what?
              • astura 1 week ago
                OMG, This reminds me of the ridiculous "50 years of travel tips" that showed up on HN a few months back

                https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43066720

                Including gems such as:

                -have your Uber driver take you to his mother's house so she'll cook for you

                -crash a wedding, you'll be the "celebrity guest"

                • rsynnott 1 week ago
                  > Even if you never go to McDonalds at home, visit the McDonalds on your travels.

                  Eh?

                  > If you detect slightly more people moving in one direction over another, follow them. If you keep following this “gradient” of human movement, you will eventually land on something interesting—a market, a parade, a birthday party, an outdoor dance, a festival.

                  Or, y'know, a train station or something.

                  I'm slightly unsure whether this is parody or not.

                  • gs17 1 week ago
                    The McDonalds part isn't as weird as it sounds. Almost anywhere outside the US, it's very different and usually much better, and they redesign portions of the menu for the local cuisine (e.g. there's teriyaki burgers and fillet-o-shrimp in Japan, a lot of veg options in India). I wouldn't make it a priority, but it's really interesting to see at least and not an expensive or long sidetrip. It's definitely a more "American" perspective, but there's a good reason.
                • corimaith 1 week ago
                  The usual this is why we can't have nice things. Hospitality only thrives when it is not abused as an expectation rather than a privilege.
                  • anal_reactor 1 week ago
                    The more I interact with people the less I think of an average person. Case in point - my neighborhood has a huge trash problem. People just dump it on the street. Why some communities consider that normal behavior is beyond me.
                    • graemep 1 week ago
                      > Why some communities consider that normal behavior is beyond me.

                      Because they are not real communities. People living in the same place but with no sense of connection or shared identity or shared interests.

                      • mc32 1 week ago
                        Those humans are creatures and lack a bit of that which characterizes civilization. They exist in all countries and within all ethnicities, sometimes to varying degrees, but they are everywhere.
                    • deepsun 1 week ago
                      Don't forget that "tourists" also get stereotyped. There are respecting, caring and careful tourists, who don't try to overuse the hospitality.
                      • Aeolun 1 week ago
                        Also, everything has become absurdly expensive for the locals. During covid you could often find a hotel for 10,000 yen.
                        • forgotoldacc 1 week ago
                          Pre-covid/covid times were great with 8000 yen business hotels in Tokyo. Capsule hotels were meant for salarymen and available for sub-3000. Now they're also part of the country-sized amusement park experience. Capsule hotels now easily exceed 10000 yen and business hotels can be over 30000 (I've seen 45000 for shabby places that would've been half empty pre-covid).

                          Wages are also not moving and locals are becoming second class citizens in their own country and rapidly. Add it to the entitlement everyone has and the "hospitality" that used to be found everywhere is now rapidly and noticeably going away. People don't know just how different it was before the tourism boom.

                          • tecleandor 1 week ago
                            That expensive? I've been checking prices this past weeks and I've seen prices around 8-10000 yen for regular hotels.

                            Got 5 nights in Asakusa for ¥43000 (in a hotel that's a bit more tourist oriented), and also got offered by Smar-EX a combo of Nozomi round ticket to Kyoto and three nights there in what looked like a business-hotel for a total of around ¥45000.

                            But of course, no doubt everything is getting expensive and crowded. I have "almost family" there, and I've been 4 times since 2007 (this next month is going to be my fifth) and the change on tourism was already very noticeable around 2018. And the numbers after COVID went crazy, and the low Yen is helping that too.

                            And it can be seen on the flight tickets too. Prices went down after the Tohoku tsunami (I remember paying around €470 for a round ticket in December 2012 or so), in August 2015 I paid €750, in August 2018 €780, and this year for July it's ~€1200 for economy and more than €2K for Economy plus (!). I guess that also having to avoid Russia helps raising prices.

                            I'm worried they're going the same path than here in Spain, where trying to find a room in Madrid or Barcelona for less than 70€ a night usually means having a shared bathroom, or even sleeping in bunk beds in a 8 to 12 person room. Not to talk about the rentals or general real state prices...

                            Edit: Ah, of course, as GuB-42 says, Rail Pass has doubled. But I guess that due to the low prices the trains were getting crowded and unavailable for locals... It's a bummer, but I'm not mad at all.

                            • Aeolun 1 week ago
                              It’s not like things have become unbearably expensive though. It’s mostly tourist stuff. I’ll certainly take Japan over the price increases I’ve heard about in the rest of the world.
                              • GuB-42 1 week ago
                                I went to Japan in 2019 and 2024 and didn't notice a significant difference except for things that are clearly for tourists. The biggest one being the Japan Rail Pass, which almost doubled.

                                An important thing to consider is that the yen is really cheap now, it means lots of tourists because life is cheaper and high prices for imported goods for the locals.

                                • washadjeffmad 1 week ago
                                  Having come to have known the Japan of the 90s, I was disenchanted enough by my last trip in late 2019 that I haven't made plans to return.

                                  The traveler zones full of English and kitsch had swollen to encompass everywhere within walking distance of the first 6-10 stops out from any major station. The apartment prices out there also remained high, despite how poor and relatively unpopulated the areas were.

                                  And, nostalgically, it was filled with Chinese families that reminded me of the tired, loud, inadvertently rude Americans that stood out 30 years ago. I was surprised to see the formerly silent annoyance of the locals towards them and every other dayhike backpack-wearing, heavily scented foreigner simmer over into someone saying something as they exited the trains more than once. When people couldn't give them their own cars, they turned their backs and give them an obvious wide berth.

                                  Even Kyoto was like this, and I had to travel far enough off the beaten path to find somewhere that didn't feel like either a Japanese theme park or any other international city in the world that I just ended up staying in my family's home village, where only the parents and grandparents hadn't left.

                              • ronsor 1 week ago
                                > So now a non-zero number of people go there with the expectation that they can (and possibly should) do the same.

                                Is this actually common now?

                              • gwd 1 week ago
                                I feel like every word in the title is deceptive: Someone you're renting a room from is not a "stranger", nor is their renting it to you "generosity", nor are you simply "getting by". "Enjoying the hospitality of small guesthouses and private hosts" would be much more accurate.
                                • danielscrubs 1 week ago
                                  Im wondering if tourism isnt a net negative? The tourism industry thrives which means people move to that industry, then that industry becomes so big that politicians say the country can’t survive without it, then the culture vanishes . See the coffee shops in Shibuya with majority tourists, their manner is completely different.
                                  • 1 week ago